We are not victims

[Johndoe1]

Back when my doctor and I had the talk about bras he was very much against compression tops. Both he and my wife said a good fitting bra was the best for me.

Doctors in general do not recommend compression garments to flatten the chest. The amount of pressure required can cause permanent damage to the breasts and chest not to mention the constant pain of the breasts being forceably squished. If you have discomfort when lying on your tummy,  compression tops/vests are worse. Encasing and supporting the breasts are healthier than being than flattened.

[Confused old man]

John, I agree. I started out with sports bras thinking I needed to flatten them out to hide my boobs. But at the end of the day I was always a little sore. Then I thought my boobs need a place to go rather then squishing them to death. So after a fitting at soma, my most comfy bras are soft molded cups that I can wear all day even forgetting I have a bra on. They bounce some and stick out more. But it’s about comfort for me. I still wear sports bras when I work out. But after my work out it comes off!

[42CSurprise!]

On a related subject, when I suggested to my doctor that I might wish to do hormone replacement to elevate testosterone because of gynecomastia he counseled against that intervention.  It seems that what men here are doing is really the best we can do... care for our bodies and embrace the journey we're on... breasts and all.  That may mean wearing brassieres and making that decision can lead us to some playful possibilities... all in the name of acceptance.  At least we can support one another on a journey not many men would seek out.

[gynepaul]

My doc had a different opinion than 42CSurprise’s doc.  After first noticing my breast growth about four  years ago (at age 65), he tested my hormone levels and discovered a severe testosterone deficiency.  Estradiol was also low. He quickly put me on TRT but it took a while to figure out the proper protocol.  I started on testosterone gel, moved to testosterone cream and finally went to weekly testosterone injections.  The injections now keep me at at normal T levels, and I was recently able to cut back a little on my dosage.  Since getting dialed in, my breast growth has slowed significantly, but I think there is still some minor growth that is ongoing.  There are also a number of other benefits, including lessening of fatigue, diminishing my ED, and maybe most importantly, arresting the advancement of my osteopenia which was bordering on osteoporosis.  

[42CSurprise!]

Perhaps the difference is the fact I'm fifteen years older than you are.  I honestly don't knows how our bodies come to the hormonal stew which we find ourselves living with.  Some of us developed fleshy chests when we were teens.  Some of us were prescribed medicine to deal with this or that health challenge that came with the side effect of elevated estrogen.  All of us experience a natural diminution of testosterone as we age... one figure I read is a 1% reduction each year beginning at age 30.  That would mean by age 65 you would have naturally lost 35% of the testosterone in your body and I'd have lost 50%.  I've read as well that TRT is contraindicated for anyone with prostate issues, whether BPH or cancer.  A participant on this forum also speaks about how testosterone supplementation can be converted to estrogen, thus exacerbating gynecomastia rather than relieving it.

We each find our own way through this particular minefield.  My doctor's opinion was likely affected by my history of BPH and elevated PSA scores.  I've decided not to mess with Mother Nature.  He made no comment regarding brassieres however.  I didn't ask...

[Johndoe1]

On a related subject, when I suggested to my doctor that I might wish to do hormone replacement to elevate testosterone because of gynecomastia he counseled against that intervention.  It seems that what men here are doing is really the best we can do... care for our bodies and embrace the journey we're on... breasts and all.  That may mean wearing brassieres and making that decision can lead us to some playful possibilities... all in the name of acceptance.  At least we can support one another on a journey not many men would seek out.

I had this same conversation with my doctor and because of my estrogen level, HRT was not recommended. The fear was even with a estrogen blocker, I might still experience a growth of one cup size. As she put it to me, growth of one cup size from flat to AA was no big deal. But growth of one cup from DD to F or F to G was a big deal. I think it depends on the levels of estrogen and testosterone you have and how much breast growth you already have determines whether HRT is recommended. For me, short of surgery, due to my size, breast support was the better choice of action.

[Evolver]

I'm glad in a way that this thread has gone towards talking about our 'hormone stew', as 42C often puts it. If we think about estrogen as the female hormone responsible for secondary sex characteristics such as breast growth, and accept that just as all women have some level of testosterone, all men have some level of estrogen, it is not hard to come to the conclusion that if the balance between the two is as designed, men wouldn't grow boobs and women wouldn't grow hair on their faces. Obviously, if things are out of kilter, those physical side effects can occur. And again, obviously, that's what brings most of us here.

So, is gynecomastia a result of low testosterone/normal estrogen, or normal testosterone/high estrogen? Does it really matter? Maybe it doesn't matter, maybe it's probably more to do with the ratio between them. But what if both levels are low, is the lack of T going to have a more pronounced effect on men than the lack of E? The reason that I'm fixated on this at the moment is because, as some of you might know, the recipe for my 'stew' might be getting changed in the near future for medical purposes. My T will drop to negligible levels but so will my E. I know that it's my issue to deal with, but I fear the side effects of low E, which would, in effect, turn me into a virtual menopausal woman, more than low T! 

[Johndoe1]

So, is gynecomastia a result of low testosterone/normal estrogen, or normal testosterone/high estrogen? Does it really matter? Maybe it doesn't matter, maybe it's probably more to do with the ratio between them.

It appears to be a ratio thing. The Cleveland Clinic defines gynecomastia as “an enlargement or swelling of breast tissue in males. It is most commonly caused by male estrogen levels that are too high or are out of balance with testosterone levels.” Women who develop male defined traits would also be in this same definition of ratio.

[42CSurprise!]

...Women who develop male defined traits would also be in this same definition of ratio.

It is important to remember that not all women are full busted.  Funny that both gynecomastia AND micromastia have diagnostic labels, but neither is considered a medical problem that warrants treatment covered by health insurance.  Yes, women can be as fixated about breast enhancement as men are about breast reduction, but we know that has more to do with meeting societal expectations than with a medical need.  That is a reason health insurance companies won't pay for either surgery.  There typically is no medical reason to perform such surgery.  Honestly, we are more motivated by Madison Avenue and the images we are fed through media than anything else.  The problem is between our ears, not on our chest.

We know tens of thousands of women want bigger boobs and are willing to pay to have them augmented, so there is nothing wrong with men paying for surgery to reduce the size of their breasts... but there also is nothing wrong for either women or men to simply accept the unique gifts given by nature in the bodies that carry us through life.  Trying to make ourselves more acceptable can be a haunting and frustrating journey.  Learning self-acceptance can open the world for us, whether we're considering the development of our chests or our quirky personalities.  No two snowflakes are alike, or so I've been told.  It is probably safe to say the same thing about each human being.  Enjoy the journey everyone.  

[Confused old man]

When you truly don’t care what anyone thinks of you, you have reached a dangerously awesome level of freedom!

[p.r.1974]

We are indeed not victims. It is those that think, comment or act on, and or profit from promoting others are less than that is the problem. I have no problem with someone wishing to alter their body with weight loss, exercise, augmentation, etc... But I do have a problem with industries and individuals shaming those that do not fit in their impossible standards. I do what I can to ignore these bags of feces, but it is everywhere one looks. So, I work on letting it roll like water on a duck's back.

[Busted (and happy)]

.

.  The problem is between our ears, not on our chest.


Absolutely right John + 42C and in my view (respect to those who disagree) our 'problem' has no place in a Doctor's surgery unless psychological support is being sort.
As has been pointed out there is a reason why insurance companies will not pay out. The cover is offered for genuine medical conditions. Gyne and Micro mastia do not qualify in 99.9%+ of cases.
It may not be a truth that some want to hear, but brings us back to the fact that it really us who need to sort out the "bit between our own two ears" and then get on with enjoying life.
I don't minimise the difficulty of the individual journey, but I can testify to bliss of arriving at a place of full acceptance.