experience with male mastopexy surgery?

[Bakajin]

I was wondering if anyone has any experience with male mastopexy?  what I'd like to know is compared to regular gynecomastia surgery involving lipo and removal of gland tissue, would removal of loose skin alone be more or less difficult and expensive?  also I read on another thread that skin surgery alone has a shorter recovery time, is this true?  

I used to have quite large breasts but after an 80 pound weight loss my chest is much smaller but still looks quite strange.  I still have some fat and possible a small amount of gland but the real problem seems to be the loose/stretched skin which is basically causing my whole chest to sag badly.  The skin is especially stretched/loose on the side of my chest under my arm pits.  My weight can range from 190 - 210 pounds but even when I am in good shape in the 190's my chest still looks quite bad from the loose skin. Therefore I think I should probably go for a mastopexy to fix the problem.  

I've included two picture sets below showing the problem with my chest. <EDITED BECAUSE I DIDN'T REALLY MAKE THIS CLEAR>   the left hand sides show has me with my chest flexed and arms slightly forward in the first set, and unflexed with my arms down in the 2nd set.  This is how my chest generally looks and the skin is very loose and saggy and moves around a lot.

The right hand sides show me pulling arm arms back to tighten and stretch the skin to show how I want my chest to look via surgery and also to show how loose the skin is.  This is NOT how I look usually.  You can clearly see how differently my chest hangs in the two sides and especially how different the height of my nipples is.  

this first picture is an older one of me at 198.  


the 2nd picture is a more recent one of me at 209.


I'm hoping with surgery to attain a tighter chest in all situations which resembles the right hand side photos.  is this realistic or am I hoping for too much?  I'd very much appreciate any stories other people have had with similar surgery.

thanks in advance

[unisys]

Some more information such as your age, when and how you lost the weight would help.

[Bakajin]

I'm 28 years old, 6' and my weight ranges from 190 - 210 depending on my training.  I've had my bodyfat measured professionally at between 11% and 17% over the past 6 years.

most of my weight loss occured between 20 to 22.  I've been playing contact sports most of my life, including rugby, kickboxing, judo and BJJ and I've been doing serious weight training for 9 years.  I've always been strong and have a fair amount of muscle (bench 350# deadlift and squat just under 500#) but the main cause of my weight loss was changing to a healthier diet and doing a lot of calorie control.  I should note that I've never used steroids or other similar suplements.

I've competed 15 times as an amateur but to if I want to become a pro I will have to fight bare chested, hence the desire to get my chest fixed up.  My chest doesn't really affect my personal life but combative sports in general are an area where competitors suffering from true and pseudo gyno are heavily ridiculed.

[Hypo-is-here]

90% of the people on this website would kill to have a chest like yours.

Why does such an amazingly insignificant supposed defect worry you?

Honestly there is nothing there that you would really term gynecomastia.

Every man has some amount of glandular tissue and it just seems to me that the problem in cases such as your own are due to the pursuit of perfection, the narcisistic tendancies that come with bodybuilding and pressues that stem form the groups of people you are associated with.

You have a great chest and no gynecomastia.

If you have any issue at all then it would be BDD (Body Dysmorphic Disorder).

If this feels like a problem then I think you need to speak to a therapist and try and find out why you feel the way you do and try and work the issue out that way.

I think surgery of any kind would be needless and not help you.

I am just being very honest for which I hope you don't take offence.

[phantom]

"90% of the people on this website would kill to have a chest like yours."

I don't recall being part of that survey,  what was the sample?  The point is that is your opinion that stands alone.

I don't see that rating or judging anyone's physique, gynaecomastia or not is helping anyone.  Suggesting that this guy has BDD is not, in my opinion constructive, it only serves to potentially create fears without medical validation.

But I cannot make any comment on male mastopexy as this is not something that I read up on.

[Bakajin]

don't worry about it, no offence was taken at all.  i used to have a fairly bad case of pseudogynecomastia so I understand fully how my current situation is incredibly minor compared to what many forum members here currently suffer from.  I can wear most regular clothes and my relationships are fine.  However I still receive moob comments when people see my bare chest or I'm wearing tight clothing.  Its one thing to be able to wear a t-shirt but competing barechested while being watched and judged by several thousand people is something different.   Especially when you consider people involved in the fight industry are not the most socially sensitive of people.   you could compare it to a stripper who wasn't packing heat downstairs, it would kinda make it hard to perform confidentally would it not?  

I should point out that the right hand side pictures are me doing my best to stretch my skin out tight to show just how loose my skin hangs and do not show how my chest looks normally.  Its basically what I'm hoping surgery can achieve.  If you look at the comparisons (the photos were taken minutes apart just using different poses) you can see that my nipples hang about 2-3cm lower than when my chest is tight. Thats basically all loose skin that jiggles and bounces when I move fast and creates bulges under tight clothes.   The right hand side pictures basically show the accurate line of my pec muscles.

[Bakajin]

in hypo's defence, in the short time I've been around these forums I've noticed that many people seem to fall into 3 categories; 1) people who have true gyno and have suffered psychological from it.  2) people who suffer from psuedo-gyno (the majority) and suffered similar psychological effects. 3) people who have incredibly minor cases but seem to be obsessed with achieving an unrealistic image of what they think is a perfect or normal chest.  these people IMO are very similar to people suffering from anorexia and similar disorders.  therefore his reaction is not unreasonable.

as for whether I'm in group 2 or 3 I can't say.  all I know is I'm a guy who spent 11 years with big jiggly moobs and then a further 6-7 with loose jiggly skin that seems to pass off as moobs in many peoples minds.  as vain as it might be, it would be nice to just once be able to take my shirt off and show my real body to the world that has for so long been hidden beneath the skin of my old body.

[Hypo-is-here]

"90% of the people on this website would kill to have a chest like yours."

I don't recall being part of that survey,  what was the sample?  The point is that is your opinion that stands alone.

I don't see that rating or judging anyone's physique, gynaecomastia or not is helping anyone.  Suggesting that this guy has BDD is not, in my opinion constructive, it only serves to potentially create fears without medical validation.

But I cannot make any comment on male mastopexy as this is not something that I read up on.

You can try and grandstand all you like, but the fact is this is a gynecomastia support site and Gynecomastia as a medical term comes from the Greek words for "women-like breasts."

Bakajin does not have woman like breasts, he does not have gynecomastia.

He does not even have the most minor of minor cases.

To try and talk surgery without stating the obvious would actually be doing him a disservice and I wont do that.  I would rather tell home truths that might hit home even if this means being shot as the messenger.

It is much easier to do as you would do and much harder and far more likely to result in criticism doing what I have done.  I know that I am not winning any friends by telling it how it is, but sometimes it is that way in life.

That does not make what I have done any less right and what you are doing any less wrong.  

Regarding BDD what I said was;

"IF", (with "IF" being the operative word) he has anything then it is BDD because it certainly is NOT gynecomastia.

The definition of BDD Body Dismorphic disorder is;

preoccupation with an imagined or slight physical defect of one's body to the point of causing significant stress.

Certainly he might have BDD.  But I suggested a therapist because it is for them to make such a diagnosis not me.

I see no reason why I cannot raise BDD given the circumstances.  I certainly think it is far more reasonable to talk of BDD that to talk of gynecomastia.

As to Bakajin,  If you feel the need to shoot the messenger I understand.  I would much prefer to speak in terms that you would find more pleasing but I have been thinking about your best interests even if the words I have said aren’t the ones you would have most liked to hear.


Edit.

Just seen your post Bakajin.  

Thanks for understanding.  I am not saying anything to get at you I promise, i'd never do that.

I put loads of time in round here trying to bust a gut to help people out and if there is anything I can do no matter how small- just pm me.

And Bakajin if it makes you feel any better I am post op and my chest will never look as good as yours.

Seriously you have a physique that most people would be very proud of and that I am sure will get positive comments from most sections of society.  So I would have thought your situation must relate for the most part to psychology.  Which from what I can gather can be just as debilitating and require its own medical attention.






My gyne pre op.

http://photobucket.com/albums/e254/chappy100/

Not brave enough to put the post op up yet but will in time.  Op took 3 hours and was thought to be extensive by the surgeon.

[Bakajin]

just to make things clear;  I used to have pseudogynecomastia caused by being extremely overweight.  I lost the weight and do not have gynecomastia now.  I do however have a large amount of left over skin from the weight loss and a chest that is sagging considerably that has not improved either from time or from the addition of extra muscle and further weight loss.  I would therefore like to get a mastopexy (breast lift) and I know from reading Dr Bermant's site as well as others, that a number of other people who lost weight to correct gynecomastia also had a mastopexy to reduce excess skin problems.  Thats why I'm posting here in the hopes that people who have gone through such procedures could enlighten me as to what they went through.  

so before we get too off topic I would like to get back to the original questions of what the costs & recovery times are like in comparison to regular gynecomastia is like and whether it will be easy, difficult or even realistic to change my chest over from the left hand side appearance to the right hand side one?  don't make me start making more stripper analogies

p.s. hypo, my chest actually used to look very similar to your pre-op one but I also had a lot more fat on the side of my chest which is why I still have so much sagging in that area even after the weight loss (check left hand side picture of my first set to see what I mean)  

[Midwestdude]

Hypo-is-here

I'm with you.  This is a gyne board.  Bakajin, you look great.

[Hypo-is-here]

just to make things clear;  I used to have pseudogynecomastia caused by being extremely overweight.  I lost the weight and do not have gynecomastia now.  I do however have a large amount of left over skin from the weight loss and a chest that is sagging considerably that has not improved either from time or from the addition of extra muscle and further weight loss.  I would therefore like to get a mastopexy (breast lift) and I know from reading Dr Bermant's site as well as others, that a number of other people who lost weight to correct gynecomastia also had a mastopexy to reduce excess skin problems.  Thats why I'm posting here in the hopes that people who have gone through such procedures could enlighten me as to what they went through.  

so before we get too off topic I would like to get back to the original questions of what the costs & recovery times are like in comparison to regular gynecomastia is like and whether it will be easy, difficult or even realistic to change my chest over from the left hand side appearance to the right hand side one?  don't make me start making more stripper analogies

p.s. hypo, my chest actually used to look very similar to your pre-op one but I also had a lot more fat on the side of my chest which is why I still have so much sagging in that area even after the weight loss (check left hand side picture of my first set to see what I mean)  

My gyne didn't shrink when I lost weight, it wasn't pseudogynecomastia it was diffuse glandular gynecomastia.  I went down to 108 pounds and I still had gyne.  I developed gynecomastia because of a hormone problem.

I went back up in weight as seen in the pre op picture, but in my glandular case weight loss made no difference at all.  If you had gynecomastia the same as I did look it would not have gone with weight loss.

But forgetting about that because that is me.

I just don't see any problem with your left pec, I just don't see it.

I think your chest looks really good and if there is any excess skin it doesn't detract from the fact that you just look like a guy in good shape to me with a decent chest.

I mean sure you might be able to concentrate on something you see a couple of inches from your nose but to normal people you just look like some guy in good shape.

[Bakajin]

dude, you are not reading what I'm writing are you?  I'm not just talking about my left pec.

look at the two sets of pictures.  Notice there is left hand side and a right hand side, each set has two pictures.  Look at the left picture in each set, now look at the right picture.  See the difference?  

the 1st set of pictures clearly show where the loose skin is.  The 2nd set of pictures show the difference beteen my 'sagging chest' and how it would look if the skin was tightened.  notice the large difference in height of the nipples despite the photos being taken at the same height?  the right hand side shows where the level my nipple would be at if my skin was tight, the left hand side shows how far down my nipples hang currently.   The tissue around my nipples in the left hand photos is all loose skin that dangles well below my pecs.   any fat or water tends to collect right at the bottom of the skin which gives my chest a far fatter/feminine appearance than it really is.

<added a modified picture to show exactly which area is loose skin.  There is a small amount of fat there too but it is mostly just skin>

[Hypo-is-here]

Ok I stand corrected in what I am supposed to be looking at and having looked at it;

Again I am sorry but I just think you want to look perfect and that is not the same as having gynecomastia or anything else.

I just don't think that very many people would have any problem with that at all.

You have taken what you see, a minor defect and it has got to you to the point where you want to correct this minor defect as you think it will make you feel better.

Have far do you go with this type of thing?

To me it is just the narcissistic element of bodybuilding and peer pressure that exists in such groups that makes people feel like you do.

To almost anyone in the rest of the world you look great.

Obviously I just don't agree with what you are pointing out, but whatever you choose to do I wish you the best.

I certainly don't want to argue- best to you!

[DrBermant]

I was wondering if anyone has any experience with male mastopexy?  what I'd like to know is compared to regular gynecomastia surgery involving lipo and removal of gland tissue, would removal of loose skin alone be more or less difficult and expensive?  also I read on another thread that skin surgery alone has a shorter recovery time, is this true?  

I used to have quite large breasts but after an 80 pound weight loss my chest is much smaller but still looks quite strange.  I still have some fat and possible a small amount of gland but the real problem seems to be the loose/stretched skin which is basically causing my whole chest to sag badly.  The skin is especially stretched/loose on the side of my chest under my arm pits.  My weight can range from 190 - 210 pounds but even when I am in good shape in the 190's my chest still looks quite bad from the loose skin. Therefore I think I should probably go for a mastopexy to fix the problem.  

I've included two picture sets below showing the problem with my chest. <EDITED BECAUSE I DIDN'T REALLY MAKE THIS CLEAR>   the left hand sides show has me with my chest flexed and arms slightly forward in the first set, and unflexed with my arms down in the 2nd set.  This is how my chest generally looks and the skin is very loose and saggy and moves around a lot.

The right hand sides show me pulling arm arms back to tighten and stretch the skin to show how I want my chest to look via surgery and also to show how loose the skin is.  This is NOT how I look usually.  You can clearly see how differently my chest hangs in the two sides and especially how different the height of my nipples is.  

this first picture is an older one of me at 198.  


the 2nd picture is a more recent one of me at 209.


I'm hoping with surgery to attain a tighter chest in all situations which resembles the right hand side photos.  is this realistic or am I hoping for too much?  I'd very much appreciate any stories other people have had with similar surgery.

thanks in advance

Congratulations on your weight loss.  Overweight men all tend to have breasts. I have never seen a Sumo Wrestler who did not have breasts. Hanging male breasts shown in this view also look feminine. Therefore asking such concerns on a Gynecomastia site seems appropriate to me.

After major weight loss there can be a great deal of loose skin.  For men this can result in Male Chest Ptosis or drooping boobs.  The areola and nipples can be well below the pectoral muscles giving a strange look to the male chest, especially when flexed.  Loose skin can be difficult to show in photographs.  That why I evolved the bending over view to demonstrate problems that loose skin can cause.  Male Mastopexy Breast Lift can help but there is a trade off for the loose skin.  Skin reduction scars can be a significant compromise best explored during a consultation.

Hope this helps,

Michael Bermant, MD
Learn More About Gynecomastia and Chest Sculpture

[Bakajin]

thank you for the replies.  The main information I'm still after is;

1) are the costs involved for a mastopexy alone on average more
or less exepensive than a gynecomastia surgery involving liposuction and excision surgery?

2) what are the recovery times of maxtopexy like compared with lipo and excision surgery?  for women it seems like the recovery time is a little longer than regular gyno surgery but I've heard that in the male version it is a much simplier procedure.  is this true?

3) can I realistically expect to be able to attain results similar to the right hand side of the photos?  would that be a simple or difficult procedure to attain tha result?

P.S. yes I know my case is currently minor.  However I spent 11 years with C cup sized breasts and I worked very hard to get where I am.  Yet over the past 8 years I have still received the full range of 'moob' comments from people on a regular basis especially from women and other athletes/fighters.  I can still have a normal and satisfying life but after nearly 20 years of this it would nice to be able to get over the final hurdle to a attain a chest that doesn't bounce around, jiggle and receive ridicule on a constant basis.   time hasn't helped, futher weight loss hasn't helped, building more muscle hasn't helped.  Surgery is my last option.

please don't tell me its there is no problem until you have stood and performed barechested in front of several thousand people watching you.  I've faught as an amateur in front of 2000 people and even though I had a shirt on I still received enough negative comments about my chest that my confidence and focus during the match was affected.  yes I put it out of my mind and won but its not something I want to experience regularly.