BUPA

[Jackd]

Not for the surgery itself, I've already made my mind up to pay for it myself with Benito. But I am currently trying to resolve the issues that caused the gyne and am on TRT at the moment. I have been seeing NHS consultants.. I have no real "complaint" about them, but the last two memebers of the endo team I've seen just didn't seem to know what they were going on about with regard to my problems. The main consultant hasn't been available to see me directly yet, he did pop in the first time I went there when I was seeing another member of staff and he seemed to know a lot more about it.

The 2nd Dr I saw didn't have a clue about the treatment and had to look it all up in a book which was a bit off-putting. The next appointment in 6 months times turned into about 12 months as well which is a bit dissapointing.

I have another appointment due, it was meant to be today but I specifically asked to see the main consultant, which they don't have a problem with but unfortunately they didn't realise he wasn't in the practice today!!! so I had the appointment cancelled and set back another month... fair enough I guess...

But I've been thinking, I have (well, I think I do..) BUPA cover through my work... would there be any benefit for me to go with BUPA? and if so what difference does this make? Do I see the same Dr's or completely different Dr's/Hospital? I don't really know anything about BUPA or the benefits....

As I say, I can't really "complain" about the service I've been getting so far, but as we all know, we'd all rather get the best posisble treatment available to us if the option is there....

[kingboob]

Not for the surgery itself, I've already made my mind up to pay for it myself with Benito. But I am currently trying to resolve the issues that caused the gyne and am on TRT at the moment. I have been seeing NHS consultants.. I have no real "complaint" about them, but the last two memebers of the endo team I've seen just didn't seem to know what they were going on about with regard to my problems. The main consultant hasn't been available to see me directly yet, he did pop in the first time I went there when I was seeing another member of staff and he seemed to know a lot more about it.

The 2nd Dr I saw didn't have a clue about the treatment and had to look it all up in a book which was a bit off-putting. The next appointment in 6 months times turned into about 12 months as well which is a bit dissapointing.

I have another appointment due, it was meant to be today but I specifically asked to see the main consultant, which they don't have a problem with but unfortunately they didn't realise he wasn't in the practice today!!! so I had the appointment cancelled and set back another month... fair enough I guess...

But I've been thinking, I have (well, I think I do..) BUPA cover through my work... would there be any benefit for me to go with BUPA? and if so what difference does this make? Do I see the same Dr's or completely different Dr's/Hospital? I don't really know anything about BUPA or the benefits....

As I say, I can't really "complain" about the service I've been getting so far, but as we all know, we'd all rather get the best posisble treatment available to us if the option is there....

Sounds like you are having similar issues to myself, my gyne wasn't caused by any hormonal issues (as far as I am aware), but I am currently on a TRT testim gel........... although mine was prescribed by a urologist not an endo.

Endos seem to be a bit hit and miss....... many of them specialise in diabetes and obesity and just aren't knowledgeable enough about male hormones (IMO anyway).

Advantages of going private are being seen quicker, chosing your doctor and a better service (you can hire/fire them, so they tend to be a bit more flexable about your treatment options)

Can I ask what TRT you are on and if it is working?  / what were your problems before starting on it?

I've been referred to an endo myself now, so I have endless waiting ahead of me just to get a sodding prescription and some blood tests.

I would go BUPA / private if I had the money, but money is tight right now............ if you have insurance that will cover it then USE IT......... these bastards make a fortune from insurance schemes, it is time for you to claim some back and get the BEST POSSIBLE treatment!

[Jackd]

Long post, sorry 

I think in that case I might look into whether I definetly have BUPA cover or not, and then see about changing to BUPA. Need to do a bit more research to "understand" it a bit more, but as you say, time to get the best possible treatment.

I don't really talk about my problems, but this is a fake name and it might help some others and I might get some feedback if anyone else has/had similar problems...

Anyways, I look a hell of a lot younger than I actually am, have done all my life, got gyne from a young age and all the symptoms of low testosterone levels.... I left it far too late to seek help and I regret that a lot, but last year I finally went to see my GP, he was very helpful, first he ran bloods himself and also referred me to an endocrinologist. I went to the endo's, ran through my problems and blood results etc. I was worried it might be Klinefelters Syndrome but was assured it wasn't! Apparantly it's called "secondary hypergonadism"  which I don't fully understand, but means the pituary gland in your brain doesn't function correctly therefore I have really really low testosterone levels which has been causing all of my problems.

When I was 19/20/21 even I still looked about 13 ish ? I've been on testogel and testim gels for about a year now and it definetly is working, just a tad on the slow side. I could probably pass for 18/19 now on a good day ? Am 23.  IT's not all about looks though, left me feeling very weak, very tired and I've been depressed for many years despite never going to the docs about it (I guess I should one day, but I figure sorting the problems is better than talking about them)

I am looking to ask about different TRT treatments available, I've heard about one where they inject a "pod" into you and it releases the testosterone gradually and last for weeks/months before needing another... I've heard that this is far more effective. I am also bored of using the gel every day, especially if I'm not at home. Plus it costs in prescription costs, not much I know but it all adds up.

I was looking forward to the appointment today to ask about the above, and to ask when to expect my hormone levels to "settle down" as I want to go in for surgery aiming for early next year, but really don't want to waste my money until the hormone issues are sorted and there is no risk of it returning as I am struggling to save for the first op let alone a second.

I recently started weight training as well and my body has changed quite a lot since last year so the treatment and some hard work is definetly working, I do feel physically better on the whole, but still quite tired and weak and still depressed and have a form of insomnia which I really need to sort out. I plan to post some pictures in the near future (not yet) when I go for surgery or pre/post training and pre/post op .. it won't be until next year at the earliest though. I think the changes from training etc so far have been pretty good and I do think the TRT is actually helping with the weight training... (no I'm not abusing it either!!!) I do need to work out if I'm actually genuinely lethargic, or if I'm still stuck in a lazy/depressed habit from all the years I was genuinely weak. I just feel the gels' aren't as effective as they need to be at the minute.

As for you, if you've been put on a TRT then the gyne may well be caused by hormonal issues. I don't claim to know a lot about hormones but from what I've picked up, and may not be correct, is that low testosterone levels means higher estrogen levels which cause the gyne... likewise too much testosterone converts to estrogen and can cause the same problem. I have to say that my GP is a star... he was very quick and very helpful in everything that I've needed to see him about regarding to this, it's just almost impossible to get an appointment these days! That's not his fault though I guess.

[kingboob]

Long post, sorry 

I think in that case I might look into whether I definetly have BUPA cover or not, and then see about changing to BUPA. Need to do a bit more research to "understand" it a bit more, but as you say, time to get the best possible treatment.

I don't really talk about my problems, but this is a fake name and it might help some others and I might get some feedback if anyone else has/had similar problems...

I am looking to ask about different TRT treatments available, I've heard about one where they inject a "pod" into you and it releases the testosterone gradually and last for weeks/months before needing another... I've heard that this is far more effective. I am also bored of using the gel every day, especially if I'm not at home. Plus it costs in prescription costs, not much I know but it all adds up.

As for you, if you've been put on a TRT then the gyne may well be caused by hormonal issues. I don't claim to know a lot about hormones but from what I've picked up, and may not be correct, is that low testosterone levels means higher estrogen levels which cause the gyne... likewise too much testosterone converts to estrogen and can cause the same problem. I have to say that my GP is a star... he was very quick and very helpful in everything that I've needed to see him about regarding to this, it's just almost impossible to get an appointment these days! That's not his fault though I guess.

My understanding of TRT is that there are 4 options:  Gels, patches, pellets and injections.         Patches are a pain in the arse because A) they are visible to everyone and even under thin t-shirts, B) they don't stick well.......   Gels, well we know all about them....   
Pellets require a local and the doctor making an incision or using a needle to insert them in, but they do last a while.....3 to 6 months I believe and they are meant to be good at slow releasing into the body.
 
Injections are quite common I believe - I think Nebido is what my doc was going to give me, it lasts 10 to 14 weeks, and is meant to be very good.

As for all the negative symptoms, I can really only sympathize, I am in exactly the same situation and feel the same way, lots of fatigue and a complete lack of strength despite working out, hardly ever have to shave.. etc etc etc............................... I too had gynecomastia by the age of 10 basically, made worse by being over weight... but there you go, I also waited till about 18 months ago to get any help..... (22yrs old now)

God I love the internet though, you can talk about this junk without being embarrassed or anyone you know ever finding out LOL.

I agree that I don't think the gels are effective and they are a pain, I am on two tubes of testim gel per day, and it has hardly raised my hormone levels on the blood tests at all, so now I have to be seen by an endo before I can get injections or pellet thingy.............. But I read on the internet somewhere that your body only absorbs 10 to 20% of each gel packet, so maybe that just isn't enough for some people.

PRIMARY Hypogonadism is basically your testicles don't work properly, and secondary hypogonadism is basically  pituitary or hypothalamus, thats my understanding anyway, but I'm no doctor....


Anyway, best of luck getting it sorted....... let me know if you find a good doctor to help you with TRT, because I need to find one as well! lol

 

[Jackd]

I'm not too sure I like the idea of the injections, as they apparantly have a big "spike" to begin with then gradually fade down over the weeks... doesn't sound very constant to me which is kinda important I feel, no point feeling good for 3 weeks then knackered for the next 10 weeks etc...

Sounds like we are in the similar sort of situation, suprised to find someone else in the same boat. Have you told anyone about it, i.e parents? I haven't, although think my mum may start asking questions now as the endo's called my home number before my mobile and I was at work....

I'm only on 1 gel a day, I asked to be prescribed up to 2 a day but they said no due to high blood pressure My blood results did see an improvement after a few months so it is working, just very slow. I am also over-weight, but not excessively, just seem to hold fat around my mid section i.e thighs/bum which I seriously hate!! almost more than the gyne if I'm really honest!... I think this is down to having low testosterone as I *think* that affects how your body stores fat.

Ah well, just gonna keep training, trying to sort my diet out properly again... keep saving for surgery and keep pushing the TRT

[Jackd]

By the way, do you have any insomnia/sleeping problems? Just outta curiosity, I'm convinced its linked with everything else, but the endo says that insomnia isn't a symptom of hypergonadism... more likely to be down to the depression, but I don't see how... I don't have a problem sleeping as such, I don't usually wake up in the night, just I struggle so bad to get to sleep, then I can't wake up on time in the morning and feel fooked like I haven't even been to bed! it's like my body clock is 12 hours out, feel jet lagged all the time... only I've worked since the second I left school so I've always been up by 8am at the latest (Bar weekends ) so it's not like I'm out-of-routine or had a weird body clock of staying up really late then sleeping in until afternoon etc...

[kingboob]

My sleeping patterns are a bit whacky to say the least but I don't struggle to get to sleep, more I wake up some mornings at 4am, the next day I over sleep till 10am! I do feel tired all the time either way.   The doc may say that it doesn't cause sleeping issues but it does cause depression?  - Well depression is well known to cause sleeping issues isn't it?  I'm convinced they are all inter-connected..... from what I can tell not much research has been done in this area compared to womens HRT.

I agree about the injections, I have also read about the peak / trough effect they can give....... however for me right now I don't seem to be able to absorb the gel (maybe I have thick skin??), so I will give anything a try, the longer lasting injections are meant to be better......... but you can also have the short acting ones; I have read that in America they seem to let patients inject themselves weekly at home, less testosterone in each injection but more frequency in order to get a stable level, I doubt that  would happen here in the UK, not that I would want to anyway, nasty!

I discuss everything with my Mum / family..... I get very nervous about going to doctors at times etc, so I sometimes ask her to come with me if she isn't busy, otherwise I get nervous and forget what I want to say etc....... bit sad at my age but there you go...... 

As for the fat issue...... well I am technically just obese I think, or overweight anyway by the BMI charts.  But I did / have lost a lot of weight in the past and now my weight is stable over the last year or so, but recently I have noticed I do have a tendency to put weight on around the tummy area, but I had a tummy tuck as well as gyne correction so it is hard to tell what is fat and what is swelling.

What I can say is my doc (consultant urologist), said getting my hormone levels up would make it easier for me to 'keep the weight off', and maintain muscle strength / energy etc............. so going by that I would assume testosterone DOES change the way your body stores and burns up fat; several online articles I have read backs that up.

The problem with this issue is that not many people specialise in this area, certainly not GP's.   Also there is a lot of bad information out there.  And many doctors are quite rightly very, very wary of giving people prescriptions for testosterone, because so many bodybuilders and sports people abuse it by using it in high strength quantity for performance gains. -

So you mention to them that you think your weakness & fatigue is down to the fact that your testosterone levels are down below normal range and they automatically go on the defensive, assuming that you want to be the next  Arnold Schwarzenegger, not that you just want to be on a level playing field  in the top end of 'normal range' like other 22 year old men.

[Jackd]

Hi,

You are lucky that you can talk about it with your mum and family.. I'm sure my mum would be the best person to talk to, I just can't bring myself to actually tell anyone about it all.  Was hard enough to tell the Dr's... and I only do it because I know they will work to make me better.... Sometimes I just feel it'd be easier to tell my mum, most of the time I think it's just un-neccessary. Good on you for talking about it though.

I think I am going to enquire about the pod injection thing at my next appointment. Will have to see what they say really. Worth trying out though, if it's not as effective then I can always change back to the gels.

I was also very worried that the docs would not take my seriouisly with the fatigue and weakness side of things, but suprisingly the GP was understanding and helpful with it so I've not really had too many problems with the docs.

As for the sleeping, I really need to work out why I have so much trouble, might go back to my GP actually. As it's the weekend, the past two days I've gone to bed around 1 AM and woke up around 12 feeling fairly refreshed... Should hope so for 11 hours sleep anyways... but during the week if I try to go to bed before 12 I just can't sleep at all, then have to get up at 6/6:30 ish which leaves me feeling knackered for the whole day.

Anyways, keep me updated with your TRT if poss. I'll update when I've had my next appointment and asked about the injections etc.