My story after all these years/ update/02/03/18 back surgery yesterday

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After seeing my surgeon on my 12 week post-op we agreed that it might help me to go to pain clinic! Now when I first started at the VA I asked if they had a pain clinic I was told no, but now they do so I asked when they opened this one up, and it was told about a year ago.

Debbie and I went today to the meet and greet appointment, and we both felt very good about it today! The doctor had already knew me very well! He said he had read my complete file last night, knew I served 11 years and which two branches, knew of all the surgeries I've had. We talked about the outcome of the surgeries, the good and bad parts improvements on my life and the disabilities that I still have.

He knows that I understand that I can NEVER be the old Bob that I once was, but he would like to reduce chronic pain by 25% or so if posable, and that would be great!

After he did a complete exam he said that I'm a good to go for both methods that he suggested we try. The first is acupuncture. Very aggressive multi times in one month to see how that goes, then move on to "Radio Frequency" treatment. Now as a Ham Radio operator I told him I've got plenty of "RF" in my head already! What the "RF" treatment would do is burn the ends of the nerves that go the the pain area. This treatment could last up to a year, then would need to be repeated, as the nerves grow back.

I'm set to have the acupuncture started on this next Monday, and he is going to talk to the other doctors about the RF treatment and get that ball rolling. I've been on disability for 16 years now, and it was been at least 20 years of chronic pain  I'm ready try just about anything!

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Today I had my second section of acupuncture and all I can say about it is nothing really! The night after the first time I think it was just a dream, but I felt like I was a pin cushion. I had gotten 15 needles that day. Today I got 30. The doctor said it is normal to feel like I did the first night, but it doesn't hurt to have it done. It hurts more to lay on the table that he does it on much more then the pins going in! I'm on my belly shirtless laying on those big Double Ds that do nothing but hurt when you lay on them!

I have four more times of doing the acupuncture, then the end of April we'll start doing nerve blocks. The doc and I talked about this today being a very good thing, as this last week I could barely walk due to the pain on my left side and to me it was hip, but the docs all say it isn't hip problems, so the nerve blocks should help figure this all out!

Stay happy as warmer weather SHOULD come back one day!

[Bman41]

You'll be better before you know it!

Keeping you in prayer over it all, pain sucks, I think we should pass a law against it.... 

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Thanks Bman, I'm a big believer in the power of prayer as you already know!

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Yesterday 3/31/14 I had my third treatment of acupuncture, and actually starting last Thursday I started having a pain level that was more tolerable! I didn't do any more than 30-60 min worth of psychical activity each day or work on the remodeling of our kitchen in the (mother-in-law) apartment we have in our house. Not sure if I said anything before, but our oldest is moving back to Minnesota and will live here until he gets settled, so we are setting him up in the apartment. So I've been remodeling the kitchen before he gets here and I try to keep my work day to no more them one hour a day. This is what I did for a living so I can get a lot done in an hour and it isn't that big of a kitchen!

I would have to say that the acupuncture is helping! He used 30 needles yesterday, 3-4 of them hurt enough to take my breath away! We talk as he puts them in, and it caused me to stop talking! The pain stopped within 30-45 sec.

If I stand in one spot for more then five min or try to walk to far the pain shoot up to the levels that I don't want to have to deal with, so I try to avoid the things that course it to do that of course!

Hope everyone has a great week, and no snow! It doing that again here


Bob

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Tomorrow I will go to My last acupuncture session and I'm going to ask the doctor what he thinks about me going on to the nerve blocks and nerve burning and exactly how long acupuncture last.

On Thursday I had a the 5th session and I reported that my pain level had gone up very high since my Monday session partly due to some work on the mother-in-law apartment. So he added some pins in the areas that were hurting. Thursday night Debbie and I install the counter top, I had installed the sink and faucet earlier prior to setting it all into place, then we connected the drain and tested everything including the washer/dryer unit. After all this and I've had almost a pain free Friday, Saturday and Sunday! The great thing about this news is I was still active both Friday and Saturday! Now, understand that when I say active, I don't mean like most people for hours, active for me is half hour here, half hour there, or a full hour non stop with no pain!

So if the acupuncture will last for some time I may forgo the nerve burning, if it doesn't well, it's $50 every session.

Nerve burning can last up to 9 months.

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I had my 6th of six acupuncture appointments yesterday Monday April 14th, and being that my pain level in my back has become a very manageable level I talked to the doctor about canceling the nerve block/nerve burning appointment and just continuing on with the acupuncture treatments. My first concern of course was how often I would need to come and how long they would last. Each treatment cost me $50.00 out of pocket even though I do this at the VA. The VA had different levels of qualifications and I'm at the highest pay level due the income level, so I do pay a deductible, however, I do still save a ton of money compared to buying insurance.

He wanted to talk to the other doctors about my case first before making a recommendation, so told me to stand by for a bit. I received a call a while later with plans that they canceled the nerve block/burning and another acupuncture appointment in a month.

I feel better about doing things this way because I was afraid that with no feeling that I would over do things and possibly do some real bad damage not even knowing that I was. I do have a habit of over extending myself even when I'm hurting like hell just because I want to finish a project, because I'm just bull headed, so I could do some bad shit if I had no feelings at all!

[Bman41]

I had a nerve block for my surgery, R-cuff, "full thickness tear" (aka, ripped completely apart) Supraspinatus tendon and it was the best thing.  1, less anesthetic for surgery and it lasted for 23 hours, 2, got me through the worst pain from the surgery.  I didn't feel numb or tingly at all, still had feeling.  There is 2 sides to the nerves, sensory and control.  Not sure how it all really works, but I had an EMG test done on my hands and I have moderate nerve damage from carpal tunnel problems.  I am scheduled for surgery on May 1, hope it all goes good, going to do it local anesthetic though.  That should be fun.  But recovery is super fast, they even let you drive home afterwards with a local.

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I've had nerve blocks in the past, never had nerve burning done. They said that would last about 9 months, with no pain and no feelings!

Good luck come May 1st, keeps us updated how that goes!

[Alchemist]

Hi Bob,

Sounds like you are doing well. Have you ever tried a TENS unit?  In the past at least it was claimed that the TENS unit worked well generally for those for who acupuncture worked well.  I have had mixed results with TENS.  In a special purpose unit combined with muscle stimulation it helped my peripheral neuropathies pretty well.

I went from 20 years untreated pain to another decade of severely under treated pain during which I woke up in tears each morning wishing I was dead. It wasn't locatable to a couple of identifiable point sources. I don't think I was able to get more than 4 to 5 hours of poor quality sleep a night for decades.  The first night I had morphine I slept for 16 hours in all and didn't wake in terrible pain and tears, the first time pain didn't wake me up in more than 30 years.

I've been on morphine for 14 years now and it is the only thing that works.  The TENS helped a few pieces of the pain, but it was the pain that morphine didn't work on. I don't think pain is perceived in a linear fashion any more than taste, or loudness or brightness is.  With all the strategies that work for me put together; drugs, vitamins, physical therapy, exercise, specialized TENS unit, I've had about a 99% reduction in pain.  Maintaining all these things takes 3-4 hours per day on the average.  It's not all exclusive time as I can watch a movie while I prepare a weeks worth of vitamins or the water-bath feet or hands TENS sessions or do physical therapy stretches and exercisers or indoor exercise.  If my partner were in better shape and had time I could use a couple of hours of massage daily.  I'm lucky to get a couple of hours a week and that is trade.  I give her the same.  Tantra can include massage and diet.  Ti Chi originated as a system of physical therapy for an injured emperor.  My partner is big into herbs and she has found several that are useful in nerve tonics and aid my pain control.

Pain management has a goal of reducing pain to a bearable level but it isn't zero.  The key to being satisfied with pain management is to be willing to try things for incremental improvements and accept a functional level of pain reduction without perfection.  I hope you do well because uncontrolled pain without end can turn a life into hell.

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I have a very good TENS unit from the VA, but I have very mixed feeling about it. At times it has distracted me from the pain, others times it drove me crazy, and irritated the hell out of me.

The acupuncture has reduced the amount of pain in my lower back, but I've noticed that if I'm doing something I need to stop and rest or the pain returns very fast, but by resting it will go down again, were as before it would continue to climb before and take much longer to recover.

I have peripheral neuropathy as well from the years of untreated diabetes. I use meds to treat that, however, I still have pain to deal with, and the more I do, or use my feet and legs the higher the level the pain will be that night or the next day. The neck is still a pain problem as well, but if I'm careful I can avoid issues with that.

Facts are, you and I are two people who will live a life of pain! Any reduction is a blessing, so we need to take what we can take, when we can without hurting anything else! That is why I had hope that I wouldn't need to burn the nerves if I didn't have to, but I still have that if I need to down the road.

[Alchemist]

I honestly have no idea of what not being in pain feels like.  There is no base any more for me.  I was never faced with the decision to do more damage to try to reduce pain.  As the facts are that we are both going to be in pain the rest of our lives it's a matter getting through it as best we can. A phrase that I grew to hate was "You will just have to learn to live with it".  With gyne, sure.  With the level of pain I had that just wasn't possible.  It became the excuse for not doing anything to reduce the pain.  It was a 28 year battle with doctors to get treated for pain.

It's a bummer having a lifetime of pain. Best of luck with your treatments.

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I honestly have no idea of what not being in pain feels like.  There is no base any more for me.  I was never faced with the decision to do more damage to try to reduce pain.  As the facts are that we are both going to be in pain the rest of our lives it's a matter getting through it as best we can. A phrase that I grew to hate was "You will just have to learn to live with it".  With gyne, sure.  With the level of pain I had that just wasn't possible.  It became the excuse for not doing anything to reduce the pain.  It was a 28 year battle with doctors to get treated for pain.

It's a bummer having a lifetime of pain. Best of luck with your treatments.

Thank you!

[Alchemist]

Hi Bob,

The form of the TENS unit that I found helpful is sold as the ReBuilder.  The feet are in a water-bath (2  separate ones) with Epsom salts.  The current goes through all the nerve endings,helps rebuild the ion channels and has to go all the way up to the spinal cord and back down for the other foot.  The person who devised this did it for his father with diabetic neuropathies.  It also contracts the muscles and according to the documentation, increases the oxygenation to the nerves as much as a 5 mile walk in a 30 minute session.  I have worn out 1, another was loaned out and never returned so I'm going to buy a third one.  Other people whom I have allowed to use mine have had return of feeling and some neurological healing.  Also Benfotiamin, a fat soluble form of thiamin is suppose to help with sugar damage to the nerves.

Using the water bath form for both my legs or my hands has been helpful.  I have 10 years experience and plan to continue.  I never had much success with a TENS with the traditional dry electrodes placements and usages.  As a treatment is 30 minutes a day for each placement, and they have neoprene gloves and booties that can be used containing the water instead of a water bath some people find more helpful.  With a water bath that is deep enough the entire foot and lower leg up to the base of the calf can be the nerves affected.  It is far more widespread in effect than a couple of square inches of electrode.

The same with my hands, it can affect the nerves all the way from the fingertips to the cord and back down the other side. 

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I don't have numb feet, I have extreme sensitivity in my feet! They cramp up, and feel like the toes belong to someone else! Sometimes it can feel like one foot is trying to touch my nose while the other is being twisted 180 degrees at the same time! Those feelings are none stop if I over extend myself by spending to much time on my feet! The problem being that there are no warning signs of what is to much time! One day could be less or longer then the next, no rhyme nor reason to it! It can be as little as walking to the end of my driveway 100 plus feet just once or the next time I can do it three or four times. On any day or every day, I should say they always have minor cramping, but the meds that I take help keep pain levels down.