Andractim

[vaio]

On a humerous note:

If 50 photographers with camreas in hand, all saw Big Foot in New York, and none of them took a picture, would you believe them?

Thats what this whole Andractim debate seems like to me.

All these people have access to cameras. They all have used Andractim. Some say it worked and none took photos to see before and after results?? Im sure most of them did take photos but the results were so scanty, a change could not be noticed(therefore they were not happy with the results if there were even any!). I would estimate 80%+ of people that have surgery are excited about it and end up posting pictures showing the change.

Your claim that Andractim is worth trying (hence the reason you started argueing with me after I said it wasent) has nothing to back it up, other than words.
The change people want from Andractim is VISUAL. NOT VERBAL. Words do no justice. Pictures do.

All you are doing is beating a dead hourse to death! We want photos showing what andractim can and willl do!
There are none to back up the claims, and even if there were some, they shoudlnt be this hard to find.

To put this thread to rest: Its not worth it to spend the money and try* Andractim, unless surgery is out of the question due to a hormonal imbalance. All you can do is experiment.


Good Night

[hypo]

Hehe

Oh you mean you couldn't find those reports- I guess they must not exist on the internet then either

Either that or the endocrinologists do not put them on the internet for idiots to find using google and yahoo, meaning they are on the internet but not for you to find my lad

Mmmmmm

quote from Eberle AJ. Sparrow JT. Keenan BS.

By the end of treatment, breast size in all four boys had decreased 67% to 78%.

quote from Kuhn JM. Roca R. Laudat MH. Rieu M. Luton JP. Bricaire H.

Local administration of DHT was followed by the complete disappearance of gynaecomastia in 10 patients, partial regression in 19 and no change in 11 patients after 4 to 20 weeks of percutaneous DHT (125 mg twice daily)

Quote from Glenn D Braunstein M.D endocrinologist

The non-aromatizable androgen dihydrotestosterone has been used, either by injection or percutaneously, in a group of patients with prolonged pubertal gynecomastia.  Approximately 75% had reductions in breast tissue volume, with 25% having complete response.

Quote from Eugene Shippen M.D endocrinologist

Andractim is excellent for direct application to the breast area to offset any E2 effects from other testosterone sources and will usually shrink gynecomastia.  



Have you ever had the feeling of being out of your depth  

[vaio]

On a humerous note:

If 50 photographers with camreas in hand, all saw Big Foot in New York, and none of them took a picture, would you believe them?

Thats what this whole Andractim debate seems like to me.

All these people have access to cameras. They all have used Andractim. Some say it worked and none took photos to see before and after results?? Im sure most of them did take photos but the results were so scanty, a change could not be noticed(therefore they were not happy with the results if there were even any!). I would estimate 80%+ of people that have surgery are excited about it and end up posting pictures showing the change.

Your claim that Andractim is worth trying (hence the reason you started argueing with me after I said it wasent) has nothing to back it up, other than words.
The change people want from Andractim is VISUAL. NOT VERBAL. Words do no justice. Pictures do.

All you are doing is beating a dead hourse to death! We want photos showing what andractim can and willl do!
There are none to back up the claims, and even if there were some, they shoudlnt be this hard to find.

To put this thread to rest: Its not worth it to spend the money and try* Andractim, unless surgery is out of the question due to a hormonal imbalance. All you can do is experiment.


Good Night

[hypo]

I wonder what it feels like to be simple and repeat the same mantra.

I wonder what it feels like to be simple and repeat the same mantra.

I wonder what it feels like to be simple and repeat the same mantra.

[vaio]

Hehe

Oh you mean you couldn't find those reports- I guess they must not exist on the internet then either

Either that or the endocrinologists do not put them on the internet for idiots to find using google and yahoo, meaning they are on the internet but not for you to find my lad

Mmmmmm

quote from Eberle AJ. Sparrow JT. Keenan BS.

By the end of treatment, breast size in all four boys had decreased 67% to 78%.

quote from Kuhn JM. Roca R. Laudat MH. Rieu M. Luton JP. Bricaire H.

Local administration of DHT was followed by the complete disappearance of gynaecomastia in 10 patients, partial regression in 19 and no change in 11 patients after 4 to 20 weeks of percutaneous DHT (125 mg twice daily)

Quote from Glenn D Braunstein M.D endocrinologist

The non-aromatizable androgen dihydrotestosterone has been used, either by injection or percutaneously, in a group of patients with prolonged pubertal gynecomastia.  Approximately 75% had reductions in breast tissue volume, with 25% having complete response.

Quote from Eugene Shippen M.D endocrinologist

Andractim is excellent for direct application to the breast area to offset any E2 effects from other testosterone sources and will usually shrink gynecomastia.  



Have you ever had the feeling of being out of your depth  

Hypo, there are no pictures to back up the claim on the entire internet!

[vaio]

I wonder what it feels like to be simple and repeat the same mantra.

I wonder what it feels like to be simple and repeat the same mantra.

I wonder what it feels like to be simple and repeat the same mantra.

You have been proved wrong buddy and you cannot admit it. I keep repeating my questions because you will not answer them and accept the truth.

You are like a child. You cannot and will not admit wrongness. You are unprofessional. Your the kind of person that says "its his fault, its her fault but its never my fault."

[vaio]

You have a lot of growing up to do. You act like a woman. You cannot admit you were wrong, and keep bitching and changing the subject. On a serious note, maybe you act like this because of your hormone imbalance

[hypo]

And you may be a genius, the contrary is of course probable.

You live in a black and white world and you seem to have an overwhelming interest in pictures.

Perhaps we should all write in pictures instead of words.

On a serious note do you do kids parties?

[vaio]

And you may be a genius, the contrary is of course probable.

You live in a black and white world and you seem to have an overwhelming interest in pictures.

Perhaps we should all write in pictures instead of words.

On a serious note do you do kids parties?

You must be very a very lonely person to argue with a kid on the internet all night. Now you are asking me if I do kids partys? Are you a pedophile or something?

[vaio]

You make no sense! DO you really expect people to buy something that says it will make their chest smaller without seeing before and after photos?

If you were a female, would you get breast implasts without seeing before and after photos?

If you wanted a face lift, would you get it done without ever seeing a single before and after photo from a previous case?

NO

How can you sit here and still argue with me. You have been proved wrong without a shadow of a doubt. WHat more can you possible say?

[Daveo]

You're acting like a real jackass, hypo.  What are you trying to prove?  What's all the crap about medical journals vs. the internet?  You're insulting everyone on this board.  If you were really such a guru about this subject, would you really feel the need to prove it in such a terrible way?  Christ, man, c'mon.

[aux513s]

 Hahaha this argument is getting really funny to read.  

[vaio]

It's rediculous how he keeps saying it works. There is not a single before and after photo on the entire internet proving this! You can stick out your toung all you want. Let the inner child out.  

[hypo]

Talking to you has been like trying to teach a dog a card trick :-/

But ok I’ll stop playing with you now and get serious again-  

It has been impossible to reason with you Vaio as you have been mindlessly illogical and impossibly dogmatic.

The whole point about asking you to get those endocrine reports, something which went WAY over your head was this;

Those reports I asked you to get are out there on the internet just as the before and after photographs of Andractim treatment are out there.  Just they cannot be found via google or yahoo.  They are kept as most sensitive medical material is, at secure sites that can only be accessed via medical passwords by medical professionals- like endocrinologists.

This is true of many, many medical photographs.

Do you understand that or is that beyond your comprehension?

To prove this point I am going to give you another task-

Kallmans Syndrome is a condition that exists- can you go and get me a photograph of someone who has Kallmans syndrome please?

If you cannot, does that mean Kallmans Syndrome does not exist, or does it mean you can't find one via google and yahoo for the aforementioned reasons?

Do you understand that or is that beyond your comprehension?

Dropping your fascination with the visual for one moment.

Are you telling me that the endocrinologists- ALL of them are liars and have fabricated ALL the control studies?

Because your statements are diametrically opposed to those made by the endocrinologists and do not allow for any middle ground whatsoever.

Give an answer to explain this please!!!

What do you have to say about the evidence that I have presented?

So far you've just ignored it like it doesn't exist- this is logical myopia and absolutely ridiculous.

Give me an answer to this please!!!

Are you also telling me that all the people who have noted reduction or resolution in gynecomastia on this site or liars as well?

Give me an answer to this please!!!

Are you telling me that the one before and after set of photographs that you were provided with showed NO reduction of glandular gynecomastia (irrespective of whether that individual was happy with the end result?

Give me an answer to this please!!!

I have provided the proof from no less than eleven endocrinologists, two of which are world famous and leaders in their respective fields and the fact is I have provided the proof from the actual endocrine reports from which their comments are made.

How does this square with your idea that Andractim does not reduce or resolve glandular gynecomastia.

Give me an answer to this please!!!

So there you go- making you look like a fool for easy pickings and laughs over with at least for now

Enlighten us with your answers if you can.


P.S

I only had reduction of gynecomastia being in the 75% of people with Andractim as opposed to the 25% of people who have complete resolutuion.  Probably because I had gynecomastia for years- but we wont get into that subject because you wont understand that either.

Anyway here are my photos

http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/chis_az/album?.dir=/b8ad&.src=ph

[vaio]

Hypo, you say that gynecomasita reduction is such a sensitive subject that before and after photos are not posted? Thats nonsense. For crying out loud, there are pictures of woman who had labia reductions on the internet! You can find any picture of anything on the internet. And if theres a medication that says it will reduce gynecomasitia and it actually work, you bet your bottom dollar, there would be before and after photos showing the change.

You keep saying that I think Endo's are liers. Are you fucken stupit? I tell you over and over again, results from Andractim are so minimal that you can't even notice a difference! Its the truth! Which makes it a waste of time and money. \

Stop putting words in my mouth jackass.
Your pictures below show before, a soft nipple and after, a hard nipple. Its not hard to see that!


If I took before pictures of my nipples soft and hard, there would be a major improvement just because my nipple washard and the areola muscle was contracted.

Andractim will not give the desired results as one would expect therefore it is a waste of money.