Alcohol and Gynecomastia..How?

[vaio]

Sorry to make another post on this subject. But here we go...

I know drinking alcohol can lead to gynecomastia. Im still confused on how and why. Do they mean alcohol mimiks etrogen when its in the body? Or do they mean drinking excessive alcohol over the years causes liver damage which inturn causes gynecomastia?

How does this actuall happen?

I don't drink chronocally. Everyone month (average), I drink around 6 or so beers, fast (within an hour).

*Information concerning this will be my deciding factor whether or not to drink ever again! Im gyne free, and will do anything in my powers to not let it come back.
(even give up drinking)*

Once again, how does alcohol actually cause gynecomastia? Whats the chemistry behind it all.


Thanks


Vaio

[rcbrown23]

Good question...I would also like to know more.

The only thing that I can come up with is that alcohol is known to lower testosterone levels, sometimes dramatically, and also raise estrogen levels. This is the only thing that I can see on how it would have an effect.

Six beers once a month is definitley no cause of your gyne, and in my opinion, nothing to worry about at all. That is not NEAR enough overconsumption to cause a big negative effect in your health. I am a heavy drinker ( 2 nights a week - 10 beers + 3 shots or so) and I have been doing it since I was about 17 (I'm now 25). I just had all my hormones checked, and sure enough, my testosterone was in the lower one third of "normal", and my estrogen was at the very top of "normal". On the othher hand, I am psyically fit, athetic, and my body recovers quickly. Since getting my results I have decided to dramatically cut back in alcohol (not quit), make some  changes in my health/diet, and see about natural supplements to aid in the recovery. I'm pretty confident that it will work just fine in a matter of a few weeks.

I think that over long periods of time, heavy consumption of alcohol could be the deciding factor, but not six beers a month...or even six beers a week.

I am a video editor and I just finished editing a series of health related videos for a dietitian company. They were VERY well educated in all areas of health, and they dedicated an entire section of one of the videos to alcohol. Believe it or not they recomend alcohol, on a reasonable level of course. They say that one drink every other day, whether it be a one oz shot of hard liquer or a 12oz beer, is very benificial to your health. The american health association allows 2 drinks per day for a male, and one drink per day for a female. They say that in this small amount, there would be more positives than negatives.

Again, that's just what I'm come up with on alcohol and gyne...someone with more knowledge please evaluate.

                      -Brown

[hypo]

The most visible sign of the hormonal effects of drinking is brewers droop, the very reason why a man often has erection problems after drinking.

I'll explain the mechanism.  

Drinking lowers testosterone and increases the aromatization of androgens to estrogens.  (this is partiularly true of beer which contains phytoestrogens).

This then causes a reduction in the bodies production of N.O and N.O is required by the body to produce and maintain an erection (viagra increases N.O).

Of course this hormonal change can increase gynecomastia, although gynecomastia is usually the result of more permanent hormonal changes.

On which note;

Excess alcohol intake can cause a permanent change in hormone levels and result in permanent hypogonadism, which in term often causes gynecomastia.

It is surprising how strong a poison to the testis alcohol is.  It may be directly or through its intermediate breakdown product, acetaldehyde or by increasing SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin) the carrier protein for testosterone and estradiol.  

Either way even in a moderate drinker, blood testosterone levels fall as alcohol levels increase.  Drinking enough to cause a hangover has been found to lower testosterone levels 12 to 20 hours after drinking, in one study to 20% of their levels before drinking.  It has been suggested that sagging hormone levels may be one of the reasons why a hangover feels so awful.  

This might explain those eye opening hangover cure such as prairie oyster based on boosting cholesterol levels with raw eggs, given that cholesterol is the building block that the body uses to make testosterone.  

Alcohol can cause long term testicular damage and its short term action in reducing testosterone levels and erectile function, alcohol can take away both desire and performance in men.  The first thirty percent of Malcolm Carruthers M.D (endocrinologist) hypogonadism patients reported drinking more than 21 units a week and as stated hypogonadism often causes gynecomastia.

A quote from Malcolm Carruthers M.D endocrinologist in quoting someone else.

A sixteenth-centuary physician called Cornaro wrote "the excesses of youth are like drafts upon our old age, payable with interest about twenty years after the date.  This is certainly true in relation to alcohol.


I have seen studies that also show that being tee total has its own drawbacks, so  perhaps drinking less that what is termed moderate- as in a little every now and again is a good idea.

P.S

We all have our vices though don't we and I too like a drink and am probably classed as a moderate drinker.

[vaio]

Thanks for the info. When I drink light or heavy, I still can perform in the bed room, just as normal as I could if I was sober. What does this mean?

Also is there anything, food/supplement wise, that I could take before drinking or after drinking to prevent the negative effects of alcohol on the endocrine system?

I heard somewhere that taking Zinc pills before and after drinking helps prevent test levels from droping and estrogen levels from increasing  after a night of drinking. Anyone ever heard of this before? Or something simular?

[hypo]

You drink little and it is not likely to be an issue for you.

I don't think it is the best idea in the world for anyone to try and take things in a pre-emptive effort to sort themselves out though.   It kind of gives the impression that getting into a bad state is ok.

In that regard I think a hangover for instance is a good warning light to the body to say don't do this too often.

Zinc does have an effect on aromatase and prevents the testosterone being rapidly converted to estradiol, something that ordinarily occurs with moderate to heavy alcohol consumption, so if zinc supplements form part of a diet then fair enough.  But it doesn't stop testosterone levels from falling in the short term after such drinking and it does not stop permanent testicular damage from occurring in the long term with heavy drinking or the short term with very, very heavy drinking.

This is the second time I have commented on this subject where I have done so with a drink in my hand- a little disturbing :-/

[rcbrown23]

 

[vaio]

Here's another question. Im 2.5 weeks post op. Would it be safe for me to drink moderate this weekend??

[hypo]

Oh....and again

Third beer.  

This is possibly the one and only time that a man who has hypogonadism and has testosterone replacement therapy such as myself can think he has an advantage over his eugondal brothers.  

My testosterone comes out of a packet as opposed to my testicles and so it is for the most part unaffected by alcohol.   The alcohol poisons the testicles, but my testosterone is in a time released reservoir just beneath my skin.

What a winning formula

Only kidding on all counts- four beers and that's me done.

[rcbrown23]

OK, then...Hypo, I know you're not going to like this idea.

So there has to be something out there (a pill) that can cause a sudden small boost in testosterone, right?

I think you know what I'm getting at...

The morning after, take this pill= small boost of testosterone= live happily ever after.

[vaio]

^ Thats what I am talking about. There has to be something that will prevent    aromosing (spelling).

[rcbrown23]

I'll keep looking...but now, it's St. Patricks Day, and I am forced to go out for the evening, hopefully somewhat moderately.

[hypo]

I used to live in Ireland, my dad is Irish, I’m half Irish and my second name is Irish.

Why else would I be drinking

My pushchair was searched for explosives when I was three years old in Belfast.

It is left alone these days

I am on my sixth beer now- I’m such a fool to myself, once a year though- surely acceptable

I understand why you guys are talking about this but; the whole issue is somewhat overplayed, because you guys don't drink very much or often so it means little in the grand scheme of things for you.  

You have hormones that work day in day out in a circadian rhythm no matter what and then very occasionally you disturb that rhythm, a blip, it isn't really going to do you any harm unless you have an underlying issue of concern or unless you are drinking too much or too often.

If you are concerned your estradiol is a little too high then get it tested.  If it is a little high as opposed to very high may be zinc supplementation or even DIM with indolplex in small doses will help.

In which case talk to your doctor/endo about such supplementation.

You know what I mean RC.

P.S

I shall go back to my pint now-

I have a black and white cat- I’m sure you can guess its name

[vaio]

lol I'm begining to think that I am paranoid..

[rcbrown23]

Vaio, I would have to agree...your paranoid. At your level of consumption, it's not going to be a problem.

Hypo, in regards to your comment: that is the problem, I do drink way too much, and I do it way too often. Read my first post on this thread...

I think I can keep it under control with a little effort, but there is a problem. I go on vacations a lot to visit my friends and family back up north. When I do I usually stay about a  week. All of my friends drink...every night. When I go up there I drink, every night. Like I said, I think I have the power to keep it under control when I'm home, but vacations are a different story. I also think that is where it takes it's toll on my health, when I go on these week long drinking binges. A day here and there isn't so bad.

Example: We go up to the "lake of the ozarks" every fourth of July (a big spring break party place), and all we do is go boating and drink beer ( and maybe a joint). No, I'm not one of those "spring break jocks" that get all biligerent, do beer bongs and screw women. I just enjoy drinking. I know this is bad on my health...but these are the types of things I look forward to all year and I really don't want to give them up. That is my major concern. I know most peoples advice is "you can still have a good time without alcohol" and I've heard it a million times, but I worry that ...

I don't know. You guys probably think I'm stupid for even rambling about my drinking and just think I should quit, and that's that---I'm late, gotta go, but I'll evaluate a little more later.

[Grandpa Bambu]

I don't know. You guys probably think I'm stupid for even rambling about my drinking and just think I should quit, and that's that---I'm late, gotta go, but I'll evaluate a little more later.

RC...

Your 'rambling' is not stupid at all Dude. Talking about our problems can be very beneficial.

I have a long history of binge drinking. Was in a substance abuse rehab for alcohol addiction in 1990. Didn't get into trouble with the Law/Work or anything like that , but one day I came to the realization that my drinking was a major problem. So.... I admitted myself into rehab. It was an experience! Did it cure me? No. :-/   The only way to stop an alcohol addiction is through your own desire to do so.

Over the past 8 months, I have cut back on beer drinking big time. Sure I've have tripped up once in a while, but hey... all you can do is to pick yourself up, dust yourself off and try again. Never give up on yourself.

For a long while I was drinking 6-8 Heinekens a day, every day. Not good! Was spending $300 a month on beer. That's a car payment  :-/. I felt a tad disappointed in myself  . So.... I made a decision to cut back on the beer, joined Weight Watchers ( got up to 230 pound recently ), joined the local gym and had my Gyne Op.

I'm 41 now and not getting any younger. If I continued on the path that I was on, I would probably have been dead in 5 years . I want to see my Grand Kids grow up .

We just have to get our priorities straight.....  

Anyways... life is looking/feeling good these days!  

Thanks for listening to me 'ramble' on.


John Paul...