Testosterone Therapy Update

[matthew1]

depression lifted,  still taking testosterone cream,  still off the  arimidex due to the severe depression and  hot flashes. I am reading that 1mg tabs  was way too high a dose. I need to lower my estrodiol,  its in the 80's , way to high. Meeting  with doc in a couple weeks.  Scared to  try Arimidex at lower levels  but have too  to keep my puffy nipples from getting  worse. Still  not taking the T3 either.
    Muscle [ arms and chest getting bigger ]as I work out

[skyhawk]

I can understand why you would hesitate to take arimidex at all after your experience. Thanks for keeping us posted. I am curious what your doctor will offer as an alternative to the arimidex. I know of guy who takes 1/4 pill of arimidex twice a week, plus he does zinc and DIM.
Another guy getting TRT only uses DIM for estradiol and reports no problem with gyno.   

[matthew1]

OK ,  I have  been  a few weeks on the  testosterone cream  WITHOUT taking the  T3 OR ARIMIDEX.  I was on 8x the normal does of Arimidex. I must ask doc why she did that That sent me into major depression.[ lower   E2 i think]

  Anyway,  in the  last  several weeks I have  felt better emotionally and physically   since I was  a young teen.
               I  LOOK FORWARD to working out with weights, I graduated  from my basement gym  now go to the YMCA. My  doc   doubled the strenth of my  testosterone cream  when I said I was  making  minimal progress. I have not started on the increased dose/strenth of cream yet. It on my desk
           Arms and chest are getting  beefy , strenth is wayy up. Spring out of bed in the morning.
  Tapering off the  anti depressants slowly, they  where a freaking mistake from the beginning. My  hormones caused  my depression IMO, freaking   psych doc  never  checked them.
          My only issue now  is my   puffy nipples. Meeting with   gyne doc  Magassy in VA on  wed . I am afraid  doc wont  work on me while I am on HRT .

  SO  guys,  check your hormones , if they  were fouled up  like mine, get the  help you need.
          I would post pictures  , but some guy broke into my truck and wiped me out of  my  GPS , camera, etc etc.
                   I am 6'7'' and  290,  down from  300. I am getting some definition in my  body and getting  some  stares at the  gym  nowadays;D ,   nipples  stay tight during lifting but as  soon as I stop  out they pop out 
         So I feel  VERY GOOD now, lets hope  I stay this way.
I am  doing  saliva and blood spot  test today and mailing them off  to the  lab. results go to my  doctor, then we will decide what course of action  to take next.

[skyhawk]

Great update Matt. Glad to hear you are feeling better. I have heard many stories just like yours where a physician prescribes anti-depressents and never checks the patients hormone profile.

This is not to bash physicians, but I do think its one thing that needs fixing in our medical system. Its easy to prescribe prozac and send a patient down the road.

But God bless the physician that goes the extra mile and looks for the reason for the depression and gyne. May God bless the physician who runs COMPLETE thyroid panels including free T3. And may God Bless the physician that runs sex hormones and all related labs. And last but not least, God Bless the physician who is his own man and isn't influenced by big Pharma marketing.



 
 

[matthew1]

 There is  something  desperately  wrong, in the last 48 hours in a  horrible depression again. Horrible thoughts. I  am one the testosterone  cream only this time, I have felt better in the  previous two weeks then I have in decades, now  I do not want to continue, I am hurting.
       i AM STOPPINg  testosterone alltogether       again

[skyhawk]

Matt, notify your doctor. The only thing that jumps into my mind is that possibly your Estrogens skyrocketed from the conversion of T to E. The reason I say this is because you were doing better initially, then you crash after so many weeks of Testosterone therapy. This time there was no Arimidex or T3 in the equation. It was all Testosterone, and the hormones that follow Testosterone in biological progression.

Again, my impression of your labs was that Testosterone was slightly low. And that Estradiol was extremely high. I honestly believe, from my veiwpoint, that your real problem is not testosterone deficiency, but rather estrogen dominance. This is why I encourage you to consider addresssing the high E2 levels. If you can get E2 down naturally, Testosterone will go up. Remember the Teetet -Totter illustration? 

[jackanonymous]

Why don't you just have surgery?

[matthew1]

 feeling better today,  at another site that deals with  depression ,  someone said   the  uptick in  caffeine and sugar consumption  could have triggered this depression episode. I have drank alot of dr pepper diet soda and a  bunch of icecream , that could have set me off.
        Scary, wanted to vaporize myself  one day and 40 later feeling much better.
 I do not think a day or two off the HRT testosterone cream  would have worked that fast

[rockin813]

feeling better today,  at another site that deals with  depression ,  someone said   the  uptick in  caffeine and sugar consumption  could have triggered this depression episode. I have drank alot of dr pepper diet soda and a  bunch of icecream , that could have set me off.
        Scary, wanted to vaporize myself  one day and 40 later feeling much better.
 I do not think a day or two off the HRT testosterone cream  would have worked that fast

wow..you are all over the place.  hopefully you'll get this sorted out with your online dr community.

[rockin813]

   I can say this without a  doubt,  my lifelong battle  with depression is gone  since  a few weeks after I started on these  meds, that alone is worth any side effects.

so i guess you want to retract this statement?

[matthew1]

no I do not want to retract statement, something went wrong with  my HRT, we ran another test and my Progesterone level was 547,  it should be  15- 80, I am like  7 times over the high end of the range.
               I have two endo running running about 25 blood test at two labs at one time.
           I will get to the bottom of this.
  I had drop  my AD meds dosage    to fast during this because I was feeling so much better, that was not a good ideal.
       Not taking any  hormones  now to get a new baseline  for latest blood test. I  think pharmacy gave me wrong  cream last time, thats why I had 547 progesterone,  both docs  said they NEVER seen this in a man EVER. I think  pharmacy gave me wrong  cream.
             Next time around  I will be  using an alcohol based testos cream.
 Goin to endo #2 office this coming friday for  blood test results.
  Feeling sluggish
h since I stopped the testosterone cream,
 That Arimedex 1 mg  2x a week was a wrong thing to do also

 I wil report back on Friday to post blood results after being 4 weeks off  HRT

[matthew1]

    I have  had a resurgence of severe depression,   the AD meds  have pooped out. I am in poor shape at the moment.
              I have not  done any  HRT for a 6 weeks  or more after  I crashed,   the  bodylogicmd doctor had me on T3, arimedex and  testosterone cream, . The  t3  amount of 3o mcg was  to much,  she knew I was  taking  225 mcg  for synthroid for  hypothyroid,  so  when I introduced that much t3 without cutting back on the synthroid  it made for a problem possibly.
  Also the  1mg of arimidex 2x a week was a  little much I gather.
   I   hired another endocrinologists  and  he suggested stopping all hrt, then retesting my  hormones to get a baseline to see where I stand. I got the results  today

 testosterone  serum  total 305     range 400 to 1200
free testosterone  1.6  range 1.5 to 3.2
free testosterone s   49  range   52  to280
prolactin  7.8  range  3-18
estrodiol  .61  range .8 to 3.5
 
Wierd about estrodiol,  it used to be way  way high

thyroid
t4 free  1,27   range .61-1.76
fsh  3.2   range  1.4-18.1
tsh 1.161  range  .350 to 5.5
t3  104 range  85-205

 I am hoping to start on a alcohol based testosterone cream,  doc seems  kind of  reluctant, but these numbers are not very good and should support  the cream


  I got a b 12 shot today and will do that regularly
  hoping the testosterone  cream  will help with the depression

[matthew1]

 ok feeling better


   the endo doc  wants a  test done on my  pituitary  glnd now. He has started me on adrogel testosterone  cream,   and 5 mcg of T3   thyroid hormone , and cut back my synthroid from 225mcg to 200.
    With my  testosterone at 305  and the range  being 400 -1200 he calls me borderline low!
           some folks at the  weight lifting  sites say  the  cream and gels suck, that  my levels will never go above  500 or so. I also read  that  since I am hypothyroid , my skin is thicker  and  test cream does not soak it well.
  But on the other hand the  DEPO T shots  some guys get,  they get alot of peaks and  valleys  of the testosterone  levels with shots. All I know is I want to  feel better, I would not mind getting some  results with all my lifting I am doing, gets  despondent to lift hard  for a year, see little results, come  home only to see my puffy  nipples  pushing back out.
               Oh, testosterone cream supposedly  makes  your   testis shrink,   well,  maybe they will shrink, get them down to a more managable size

[skyhawk]

Hey Matt, I was suspicious of the T3 thyroid hormone as causing the sudden depression. It makes sense to cut back the synthroid dose when adding T3. Believe me. I know what its like to get hit with thyrotoxic depression from overdose on T3. One day your doing fine, then the next day you CRASH all of a sudden falling to the floor crying for absolutely no reason. I experienced this. Its no fun.

I took androgel and my nuts just about vanished. Its also how I got gyno. Keep an eye on estradiol.

[matthew1]

skyhawk, why did you stop androgel?

 I got my androgel from the  pharmacy today, they messed up, I was supposed to get  30  day supply,  with 3 refills, I got 6 BOXES with TWO  bottles in each  box, that  900 ml of testosterone cream!!!
  One  bottle   will last 30 days at 4  pumps a day, and there are two  bottle per box. Six boxes have 12 bottles which is 1 years worth
   I think they make something to help with shrunken doo- dads.
  I  have low testosterone and some depression issues, hoping this creme will help with  both.